Why can't we reason with the radical Right? Why is good faith discussion almost always impossible?
First, they don’t want to understand us. They embrace their prejudiced beliefs and rely on their leaders’ propaganda instead.
But we need to understand them, not just by their words, but how they redefine them and employ them to attack opponents, and as evidenced by their 1/6 coup, our democracy itself.
Words have different meanings to them. They redefine words to fit their narrative of demonization.
As
Orwell’s Party member phrased it in "1984", “It’s a beautiful thing, the destruction
of words.”
They started with “trickle down economics”, “government is the problem”, “liberal media”, “Liberalism is a mental disorder”.
Soon
after, “snowflakes”, “libtards” and “anti-American socialists”, and “Democrat party
voter fraud” became expressions of their hate and lies.
But this wasn’t enough to keep their base inflamed. More fuel needed to be poured onto their flames of fury.
Here are just a few samples of their even more radicalized twisted definitions and ideological talking points:
“Critical Race Theory is Marxism.”
“Leftists
hate America.”
“Democrats
are communists.”
“Democrats
want to replace white Americans with brown people.”
“Biden
stole the election.”
Anger, fear, blame, and hate are their go-to emotional reactions when it comes to the press, public education, public healthcare, voter rights, minorities, immigrants, Democrats and progressives. Their propagandists have been hammering this into their heads for decades.
Their propagandists understand they respond to feelings more than facts, so they warp information into “alternative facts”, that elicit an emotional response.
Their extremist has reached its endgame in Marjorie Taylor Greene’s new ad. She calls Ilhan Omar, Maxine Waters, Ayanna Pressley, Adam Schiff, Joe Biden, Rashida Tlaib, Nancy Pelosi, AOC, and Elizabeth Warren, “Communist Democrats who hate America, hate God, and hate our way of life.”
My observations have brought me to some conclusions about what forms the foundation their radical Right ideology.
Their rigid belief system depends, and is built upon, the ruins of their destruction of words.
Thus:
Ignorance
isn't ignorance to the ignorant.
Stupid
isn’t stupid to the stupid.
Delusion
isn’t delusion to the delusional.
Racism
isn't racism to the racist.
Bigotry
isn’t bigotry to bigots.
Fascism
isn't fascism to fascists.
Treason
isn't treason to the traitor.
A
cult isn't a cult to the cult.
A third of Americans embrace at least some of the radical Right’s “Great Replacement Theory”.
Most Republicans believe Trump’s Big Lie about a stolen election.
Their
hate for racial and gender equality, journalism, public healthcare, public
education, democracy, decency, truth, voter protections, impartial elections,
and most Americans tells us THEY are the ones who hate America.
The radical Right ignorance, stupidity, delusion, racism, bigotry, fascism, and treason of Trump’s cult have undermined truth and election integrity, and incited open insurrection and radical Right terrorism.
They are reason why we are desperately clinging to the precipice of a divided and failed republic.
And
the radical Right will STILL blame “commie” Democrats and progressives.
Posts
39 comments:
You have just described yourself.
Anonymous,
While you think you're being clever, what you have done is project yourself as someone unable to employ facts and reason to substantiate an accusation.
Thanks for playing. You win a cookie!
You may have hated him before. You may have hated him during. You may still hate him since. But the justice system (trial of Sussmann) is finally bringing out the truth. Hillary Clinton and company all along have lied to you. They have tarnished his reputation because of their lies. The media and the Trump haters were convinced the lies were true. The best you can do now as a Trump hater is redirect that hate toward those that lied to you. But you won't.
And you want us to reason with you? LMAO
Anonymous Vern.
News flash: Hillary has never been president.
In addition, Trump lied to us thousands more times in 5 years than Hillary has in the last 30 years.
Only an idiot, sociopathic authoritarian liar, or Trump cult zombie, would be unaware of, or deny, the thousands of lies Trump fed his authoritarian followers. From his racist birtherism to his Big Lie about the election that he isn't man enough to admit he lost.
How can anyone reason with a cult? How can anyone tolerate a man who PRAISED a mob of terrorist thugs who tried to overturn our election?
Who really hates America and our democracy?
Last I heard, Hilary isn't under criminal investigation, like Trump is. Let's see how the justice system pans out for your slimy savior. He can't buy ALL the judges.
And you think YOU can reason with anyone? Anyone at all?
LMAO!
This post would look like just another trolling, probably.
But I'm foreigner, totally have no play in your inner USA political game.But never the less, this far, was reading and listening about that much, so there is some observations I cannot shrug off.
So, here it is.
It looks like Dems and Reps traded places.
Reps are not conservative anymore. Really they are shakers and rebels against "new normal".
For example.
As pro-gay people in 80th. They was "unreasonable" and rebelous to that what was seen as unshakable norm.
And gosh... was there much sense in their growls? was they reasonable? was they open and eager to discuss their ideas with counterparts?
And Dems, looks like conservatives.
Really. Their talks today is all about preserving.
How do you think? have it any merit, such an idea?
(Foreign) Anonymous,
American politics is confusing and politicians are often irrational.
I'll try to sort it out as simply as I can.
Democrats are still the party of progressive change. They support civil and voter rights, reproductive freedom, public education, public healthcare, and social safety nets like Social Security and unemployment benefits.
Republicans oppose generally everything that doesn’t benefit the rich and powerful and conform to conservative religious doctrine. (Our Constitution specifically rejects laws and governing based on religion. Republicans don’t care because the religious Right is their voting base.)
Since the Civil War, southern Democrats (Confederates) and northern Republicans have switched sides on racial issues. In the 1960's Democrats advanced civil and voting rights for Blacks. Northern Republicans joined Democrats in the cause of equal rights.
Now Republicans are opposing fair political representation and voting rights for Black communities. They are taking away women's reproductive freedom and censoring educators.
They are opposing teaching the history of slavery and racism. "Whitewashing history" is a term for it. They call it “Marxism” or communism.
Under Trump, Republicans have become radicalized far-Right extremists and white nationalists. They largely support his illegal coup to overturn our election.
They are more interested in personal power and protecting wealth than representing the common people.
In this sense Democrats are the more conservative defenders of our Constitutional voting rights, civil liberties, representative democracy, and peaceful transition of power.
I hope this helps.
Thank you for you response.
Well, I would not try to propose my thought here, if I would not now that trivia you generously provided.
\\American politics is confusing and politicians are often irrational.
Well, that goes without saying.
But really, isn't all politics and everywhere is just the same?
They proclaim being "sevants for the people". That they go to power with needs of people in their mind.
But like to subvert meanings and redirect that dependence.
From they need people to have power, into people need them... to do anything they like.
What I tryed to say.
It seems that in any time and any country, there is two tendencies:
conservative -- to make it all continue as it is,
and
progressive -- with ideas how to change status quo.
Also, more sharply, it manifests itself in history as
revolutional and reactional(to topple that revolution)
And, given with current economical circumtances.
It looks like Dems "progressive" stance is really are status quo.
And what Reps trying to do, is like "revolution" against that status.
Well, you can say that Dems are revolutionaires... that successded
and Reps are reactionaries who want to revert all that changes.
"It looks like Dems "progressive" stance is really are status quo.
And what Reps trying to do, is like "revolution" against that status."
Indeed. The roles are reversed somewhat. However the changes from Republicans are not progressive, but reactionary and regressive. Rolling back women's reproductive rights and imposing greater restrictions on voting, while making it easier for corporate and secret money sources to influence legislation.
They do everything to protect the insurance and pharmaceutical companies from regulation and accountability to the public. Even in healthcare, it's profit over people in the US.
But yes, it's basically a universal tendency for governments to support corporate power and interests of the economic elites.
Besides denial of universal healthcare, what's different about the US is the entire Republican party does the bidding of weapons makers through the NRA.
This means flooding the country with military style weapons of mass death and requiring zero training and minimal screening for purchasers.
We've seen the bloody results in horrible massacres in Buffalo and Texas just this month.
Just for the sake of discussion.
"However the changes from Republicans are not progressive, but reactionary and regressive."
Well, that cannot be that clear. From wider historical perspective.
Like, I think French Revolution is the best example for studing.
Napoleon was clearly a reaction to revolution... but gosh, he clearly achieved lots and lots, and in terms of progress too.
If only there'd be a way to make progress steady and calm way...
but seems like it is impossible.
"Rolling back women's reproductive rights and imposing greater restrictions on voting, while making it easier for corporate and secret money sources to influence legislation."
Strictly speaking... abortion is like oxymoron to reproduction, isn't it?
Also. Basic economical calculations show that USA(and Europe) need to do something and quickly to rise number of inhabitants. To be able to compete with that billion-headed monster of Asia.
Isn't it?
So, there is goal, and there is clear lack of means to achieve that goal.
And like politicians of all times and kinds like to say -- greater goal allows any means to be used to achieve it.
"This means flooding the country with military style weapons of mass death and requiring zero training and minimal screening for purchasers.
We've seen the bloody results in horrible massacres in Buffalo and Texas just this month."
You remember, I'm foreigner.
And while I cannot say too much how I sorrowfull about such cases.
But.
Same time I hardly can wrap my head around it to propose anything to fix it.
Because in my country, as in most countries in the world -- problem of teens (I dunno, why your news media call 18, almost 19 years old -- a teenager??? Or that is just an accident?) having access to a military grade weapon to shred his classmates is basicly unexistant.
Well, there is access to hunting weapon. And with enough training/resolve it becames not less deadly.
Even knifes can be used for that. Though with much less effect.
Or cars.
Still, it seems like that is not freely accessible weapon that defines possibility of it.
From my far-away perspective -- that is media coverage that made it possible.
New and new mass-shoters learn from experience of previous cases that that is possible, and for whatever reason they find -- desirable.
And... I was not looking into this much. But isn't it's true, that reasons of that shoters remains never known, or never spelled out to the public???
Maybe there is the reason -- we do not understand their reasons, that's why we cannot prevent it?
Foreign Anonymous,
What country do you live in?
"Republican" has a different meaning in the US and France. As I noted the Republican Party went from emancipation of slaves to the Nixon's "Southern Strategy" and would largely oppose civil and voting rights. Especially in the South.
Democrats went from being Confederates to northerners advancing civil and voting rights.
Overall, it’s debatable whether Napoleon was good for France, isn’t it? His people and many others suffered for his military aggression.
Guns. The US is unique among industrial "democracies" in mass murder and racist violence.
Slavery the the long history of racism and its effects have played a large role in this.
Safety training, background checks and licensing would screen some unstable people away from weapons purchases. But it’s too late for the US to control or lessen gun violence. Weapons have flooded the country.
We know that emotional instability, bigotry, white nationalism and racism are “reasons” for mass murder.
Motives based in anger would be a better word, because those murders are hardly acts of reason.
\\What country do you live in?
I would like to know your intuitive guess on that part first. Can you satiate this me request?
I think it would be interesting for you too, as excercise in revealing possible prejudgices.
\\Overall, it’s debatable whether Napoleon was good for France, isn’t it? His people and many others suffered for his military aggression.
Yes. That's the whole point I mentioned him -- we cannot be picky about history.
\\The US is unique among industrial "democracies" in mass murder and racist violence.
As for "racism" I think reason is apparent. USA is the only country with that big amount of visible different racially people.
But passively agressive racism... is not that sweet cookie too, believe me.
\\Motives based in anger would be a better word, because those murders are hardly acts of reason.
As of this... as I said, I don't know. It's hard for me even to imagine something like that.
Foreign Anonymous,
Asking me to guess where you're from is manipulative and dismissive of my request. I have answered your questions in good faith and expect good faith in return.
I'll tell you what I'm prejudiced against.
Bad faith conversation.
White racism in the US is historically rooted in slavery and Southern resentments over losing their war to preserve slavery.
In case you're philosophically conflicted, I'll tell you an objective truth. Slavery and racial discrimination are NOT fair, despite rules and laws that allowed it.
Rules favoring one race/class/religion/political party, etc. are unfair. Period.
Do you understand this yet?
\\Asking me to guess where you're from is manipulative and dismissive of my request. I have answered your questions in good faith and expect good faith in return.
Do you really see it as a trap? What would be that trap about -- that is puzzling in itself?
From my side that is just curiosity. It is really interesting what your guess would be. And as easy to see -- that game can be played only once. Because, if I'd blurt it out right away -- it will be impossibe to explore it.
So, I will postpone it for yet one comment. With hope that you really are that highly intellectual fellow as it looks so far and understand my point here.
\\In case you're philosophically conflicted, I'll tell you an objective truth. Slavery and racial discrimination are NOT fair, despite rules and laws that allowed it.
As you already could understand, I am not from country where slavery and racial discrimination still exist. Like in USA.
But that doesn't mean that we do not have OUR share of social and moral issues here.
So. This your shouting at me.
\\Do you understand this yet?
Looks like friendly fire from my perspective.
Foreigner,
You said, "From my side that is just curiosity."
What about my curiosity and reasonable question?
To tell the truth, I'm not sure what you understand or don't about my statements.
You ask a lot of questions, yet won't answer just one of mine.
You imply I don't know about the US being called fascist by Russia and China in WWII, and don't offer any information. Do you know something about that that I don't? And if so, why won't you offer information?
If you won't tell me where you're from, how can I possibly know what your social and moral issues are?
I don't know why you resist explanations or answering a simple question.
If you are indeed "friendly" why not answer my questions? Are you here just to play games?
I'm Ukrainian. (it's a shame such a chance of intellectual game... wasted)
And just now our enemies, enemies who want us dead as nazis wanted dead jews (well, they killed many Ukrainians with semitic and any other ancestry in their time too),
AND
they trying to spread nasty poisonous propaganda -- that we Ukrainians are... (drum beating) fascists. And they even, guess what, they claiming doing "denazification" on us.
That alone should be urbi et orbi enough as explanation WHY I so uneasy with that termin "fascism", as well as about mentioning my counrty too.
Happy?
\\Thank you for this information. It opens new areas for discussion and offers context for a few things.
You welcome. I am also seek for this chance to give more audacity and to clear grave prejudices instigated by putins-propaganda against my poor Ukraine.
\\Now you have Putin, another fascist, sending soldiers to commit murder and other war crimes.
See... here are differences in our approaches, I deem it as very important to point out, as in context of our previous discussion, as for further ones.
I don't care about calling him "fascist". Because, there is dire need to punish him and all his minions and all of his "orks" for their crimes, but more important is to kill as many of them here and now to ward em off our territory, but even more important is safety of my folk and reconstruction of towns they destroied -- do you know that now millions of Ukrainians have no homes to return to, and even more -- ruSSians took like million and a half of refugies of war, forcebly, to their territory, among which are 250 thousands of ukrainian children, they want to make or already made orphans, want to brainwash em, to teach anti-ukrainian way, to make em soldiers in their future wars -- ones about which there'd be no trails of sorrow to send to a sure death as cannon fodder.
So, what benefit in calling him, them all "fascists"??? If there'd be no wrath of justice on them.
\\"De-nazification" is his lie to cover for his hostile nationalism, greed for power, and brutality.
Please, call it imperialism. Because there is no trace of "national" in his idea -- he destroys russian nation (well, if there even was one: my ukrainian snark) for the sake of restoration/resurrection of damn rotten corps of "jail of nations" -- Russian and then USSR empires.
That's my point of view on that.
\\As I've written, Putin won't "de-nazify" the US, even if he could.
Sorry to point to that, but I would not be so sure. Putin already devised whole set of doomsday devices to do just that, and in their propaganda they DO discuss non-stop different scenarious: giga-ton bombs, mega-torpedos, Yellowstone vulcane (artifical) eruption and etc. And I see USA strangely calm about such perspectives. Like waiting for another Pearl Harbor incident to rise against apparent, drooling from desire to kill, enemy.
They maybe putting their claws into body of my dear Ukraine... but that is you, USA they want to destroy. And what Putin doing just now, what you can see as pinnacle of his murderous barbarism, maybe, I, as someone who are much closer and understand his culture and his state of mind -- I know that is just a very beginning of preparation to even bigger war -- with war in Ukraine Putin just try to make his citiz.... em, slaves more bloodthirtsty and ready to die for a greater cause.
The same what Hitler did...
\\For another reference, here are the warning signs of fascism posted at the Holocaust Memorial in Washington DC:
See... there is a big problem with that definitions.
Just now, as my Ukraine is in state of war -- most of that "signs", if not whole all, can be applyed to Ukraine, undenyably.
And that is what Putin like to use very much.
Putin has been targeting the US, NATO and Britain for years.
Trump and Brexit are two of his victories. The NRA (National Rifle Association) has been supported by Russia and has been working with Republicans to divide the people and secure domestic instability with vast numbers of assault weapons sold to almost anyone.
Putin is indeed acting like another Hitler, which is why I call him a fascist. His war is also an act of imperialism, even though he sees it as “nationalism”. He says Ukraine is part of Russia. Ukrainians disagree, and are being killed for disagreeing.
Fascism, patriotism, nationalism, and imperialism are terms that have multiple variations in definition.
Fascism is a difficult term to define as a unique and specific system. It has been manifested in different countries with differing characteristics.
Two definitions:
Fascism is a system of government led by a dictator who typically rules by forcefully and often violently suppressing opposition and criticism, controlling all industry and commerce, and promoting nationalism and often racism.
And:
Fascism is a form of far-right, authoritarian ultranationalism, characterized by dictatorial power, forcible suppression of opposition, and strong regimentation of society and the economy that rose to prominence in early 20th-century Europe.
The warning signs of fascism posted at the Holocaust Memorial in Washington DC were based on the rise of German Nazis.
1. Powerful and continuing nationalism
2. Disdain for human rights
3. Identification of enemies as a unifying cause
4. Rampant sexism
5. Controlled mass media
6. Obsession with national security
7. Religion and government intertwined
8. Corporate power protected
9. Labor power suppressed
10. Disdain for intellectuals and the arts
11. Obsession with crime and punishment
12. Rampant cronyism and corruption
These were occurring before Hitler started invading countries.
If invaded, a country will certainly embrace patriotism, control media, and obsess with national security, out of necessity.
I think Ukraine is defending human rights by resisting Russia and by prosecuting war criminals. Wartime changes circumstances in domestic policies.
You certainly have a closer view on what is happening in Ukraine regarding the other warning signs.
I see the terms patriotism, nationalism and imperialism as being on a scale:
Patriotism is love and defense of your country. (Ukraine)
Nationalism is believing your country is superior to all others. (Russia and US)
Imperialism is aggressively forcing other countries to submit to the invader’s dominance.(Russia and US)
I’m generalizing, because sometimes clear distinctions can blur.
As I said, defining fascism is difficult. “1984” author George Orwell understood this and wrote an article about that difficulty:
From “What Is Fascism”
It will be seen that, as used, the word ‘Fascism’ is almost entirely meaningless. In conversation, of course, it is used even more wildly than in print. I have heard it applied to farmers, shopkeepers, Social Credit, corporal punishment, fox-hunting, bull-fighting, the 1922 Committee, the 1941 Committee, Kipling, Gandhi, Chiang Kai-Shek, homosexuality, Priestley's broadcasts, Youth Hostels, astrology, women, dogs and I do not know what else.
Yet underneath all this mess there does lie a kind of buried meaning. To begin with, it is clear that there are very great differences, some of them easy to point out and not easy to explain away, between the régimes called Fascist and those called democratic. Secondly, if ‘Fascist’ means ‘in sympathy with Hitler’, some of the accusations I have listed above are obviously very much more justified than others. Thirdly, even the people who recklessly fling the word ‘Fascist’ in every direction attach at any rate an emotional significance to it. By ‘Fascism’ they mean, roughly speaking, something cruel, unscrupulous, arrogant, obscurantist, anti-liberal and anti-working-class. Except for the relatively small number of Fascist sympathizers, almost any English person would accept ‘bully’ as a synonym for ‘Fascist’. That is about as near to a definition as this much-abused word has come.
But Fascism is also a political and economic system. Why, then, cannot we have a clear and generally accepted definition of it? Alas! we shall not get one — not yet, anyway. To say why would take too long, but basically it is because it is impossible to define Fascism satisfactorily without making admissions which neither the Fascists themselves, nor the Conservatives, nor Socialists of any colour, are willing to make. All one can do for the moment is to use the word with a certain amount of circumspection and not, as is usually done, degrade it to the level of a swearword.
In his simplest of terms, a fascist is a bully.
Definition of Bully: “a person who habitually seeks to harm or intimidate those whom they perceive as vulnerable.”
Most people would agree, I think.
Stay safe and take care. Слава Україні!
\\Stay safe and take care. Слава Україні!
To Heroes Glory!
That two phrases come in pairs as greeting and counter-greeting and have long history of our Ukrainian freedom fighters of the beginning of 20th century fighting for Ukraine's independence. Ones, who was readily called by adversaries from Poland and Russia as "nazi colaborants" and even "nazis" themself...
"because it is impossible to define Fascism satisfactorily without making admissions which neither the Fascists themselves, nor the Conservatives, nor Socialists of any colour, are willing to make"
Thank you. That is some good input for my own thoughts about abundance of use of that swearing word. And answer is -- cherry-peeking. Everybody trying to use only that facet of it, that suit their need.
Well, for today I see it enlightening to use such an euristic(I could google for source of it, but it'll hardly add much more to it) -- "fascists of the future will be calling themself anti-fascists".
As it's easy to see -- modern Russia fits perfectly.
\\Definition of Bully: “a person who habitually seeks to harm or intimidate those whom they perceive as vulnerable.”
\\
\\Most people would agree, I think.
Except for bullies, I think.
But wait, around bullies there always is a halo of their supporters, which would not like it too. And little further away there is a circle of pushed down by that bullies, which would be scared to say it aloud and would shish anybody around them saying that. And...
Hmm. That way it looks more and more like ordinary human society...
\\Patriotism is love and defense of your country. (Ukraine)
Yes. That is how we like to use it here.
But well, today we are busy with more important things -- like how to protect ourself.
\\Trump and Brexit are two of his victories. The NRA (National Rifle Association) has been supported by Russia
It is sad thing to say. And I'm sorry to point it out.
But that one looks more like your own doing. Given with examples of real and proven involvment of RFia (like Marine Le Pen or other small neo-nazi parties in Europe, Taliban) -- that is not their level of ingenuity at all.
The same as previous (in Cold War times) tryes to influence people through Communistic International.
Or... what was tryed here in Ukraine.
They are not so bright as to influence some wealthy brat in 80th... so he in couple of decades would became prezident of USA.
There is that serial about that kind of setup -- "Americans".
And while overly realistic and very good made. Regarding trivias and practices of spying in Cold War times. It is utterly laughable in it's core idea of "deeply embedded resident"... which even have full-grown family in USA -- that is flatly and definitely impossible. And not just because that'll be psychologically destructive for such agents...
But because mere russian (and every other,I presume) spying organizations, being utterly paranoid, would not allow such level of trust in their members.
I you permit, I want to try to play here role of "advocate of the devil" -- it's when person trying to support views that one utterly do not support, for the sake of better understanding and keeping own biases in check.
\\1. Powerful and continuing nationalism
Russian propaganda tend to point at it -- how we ukrainians wear "vishivanka" -- our ukrainian folk attir.
And also, we do walks with torchs in comemoration of our country national heroes -- isn't it counts as "powerful and continuing nationalism"?
\\2. Disdain for human rights
Well, that is Russian's human right to speak Russian, isn't it?
And while Ukraine trying to undo some of destructive for our nation imperialistic policies of USSR and Russian empire -- fuzzing and deminishing role of Ukrainian language and culture -- isn't it apparent breaching of human rights to do that?
\\3. Identification of enemies as a unifying cause
In Ukrainian schools we teaching little Ukrainians how Russians was doing all kinds of bad things to our ancestors, means teaching em to see Russians as enemies. Instead of teaching em to "forgive and forget".
\\4. Rampant sexism
Hmmm... well, I think it could be found too. With enough of trying.
Just give some proficient american feminists a chance to do that. ;-)
\\5. Controlled mass media
Yeah. We just closed several TV channels which was working on Russian money and was spreading russian propaganda and/or was managed by fifth colomn.
Also, we block access to some russian sites and social networks.
\\6. Obsession with national security
Emmm... hard to envision something here. Guess one need to be true russian propagandist to do that. :-)
\\7. Religion and government intertwined
Yeah. That how new Ukrainian Orthodox Church was established as independent from Russian...
\\8. Corporate power protected
Ummm... Ukrainian oligarchs.
There so much that can be said here. :-)
\\9. Labor power suppressed
You mean "labour unions"? They practicly unexisting. Or under hnd of oligarchs.
\\10. Disdain for intellectuals and the arts
Well, you know what was previous work of our current Prezidente, isn't it? :-)))
\\11. Obsession with crime and punishment
Easy! What we do with poor innocent russian soldiers in courts just now.
\\12. Rampant cronyism and corruption
Second name of Ukraine. As they say. :-)
PS What do you think? Was I compelling?
You should be a lawyer. ;-)
Of course, all these warning signs and characteristics of fascism are present in almost every society.
With fewer votes, American Republicans have more power in the federal government than Democrats. Our experiment in a democratic republic is failing due to an outdated Constitution that featured some provisions that suppress democracy and majority rule.
Our Declaration of Independence supported the idea of "consent of the governed", but compromises with slave owners made quick work of eliminating equality and democracy in our history.
Progress has been slowed, and now women's reproductive rights and minority voting rights are being restricted.
Our Senate is run by minority rule. 41 conservatives can block any legislation supported by 59 Democrats. And democrats have won more votes than republicans in 6 of the last presidential elections.
In summary, the US is a failing republic and is falling under radical Right authoritarian rule. Conservatives refuse to do anything about mass shootings in schools with military style weapons anyone can buy with little to no oversight.
Democracy is struggling around the world, and has been suffering due to the likes of Trump and Putin.
A lot of the problems in the world are caused by authoritarian personalities who value power and personal wealth over the public well-being.
It comes down to bullies, or as research shows, authoritarian personalities.
Here is a good introduction to the subject:
The brains of bullies/authoritarians are measurably different from most of us.
American conservatives are generally far more authoritarian than liberals.
Liberal vs. Conservative: A Neuroscientific Analysis with Gail Saltz
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=kI-un8rHP14
\\You should be a lawyer. ;-)
Interesting idea, thank you. Never thought about it.
\\With fewer votes, American Republicans have more power in the federal government than Democrats. Our experiment in a democratic republic is failing due to an outdated Constitution that featured some provisions that suppress democracy and majority rule.
This one I cannot comment. As faithfull foreigner I trying to follow that policiy that internal questions of a nation is its own private business.
As I would like same for my Ukraine.
"Dirty loundry" of an internal politics.... too delicate.
\\Democracy is struggling around the world, and has been suffering due to the likes of Trump and Putin.
For that, as it looks as more general question, I can give my thoughts though.
I think that stagnation of a technological progress is the main reason.
Because of very fresh example -- in 90th, when progress of IT technologies was just stunning. All kinds of dictators and anti-democratic moves was saturated -- as it was obvious, that only by mimicing and following direction of democratic countries progress one can succeed.
And that is not an accident, that now, when example of democratic growth became not that bright, all kinds of orthodoxal head-turned-back-into-bright-past guys became louder.
Well...
There is a question I asked in other thread. Unanswered. But I still curious 'bout it.
During news stream about Uvalde. They. Mentioned 18 year gunner as a "teen"?
Is it common in USA, or that was just an accident?
Foreigner,
"Teen" is from the English spelling of 13 through 19.
In the US, people from thirteen through nineteen years of age are considered teens.
Some have noted our media has a tendency to refer to 18 and 19 year-old Black criminals as "young men".
Non-Black criminals of the same age are more likely to be called teens.
Hah... that's how it is. Thank you.
That's how misunderstanding can come up by itself.
I had understanding "teenager" as separate word. Not related to count.
Well, yeah.
Only about what?
It seems like reasons to discuss was eliminated -- we discussed Pu, and we agree that he is a scumbag. What's more?
Yes, I wish Putin would drop dead. I'm afraid the world will never run out of authoritarian scumbags to discuss. They are spreading hate violence and death everywhere.
I'd like to learn about what our media does not show about the effects of the war, what the people are thinking of being caught up in the West v Russia conflict, popular support for the Maidan Revolution, what your experiences have been, and what you have seen, etc.
Are you in Ukraine? How are you involved in the war? Are you and your family safe?
I understand if you'd rather not dwell on these personal topics. People generally don't like talking about being in wars. It can be difficult for a number of reasons. It took many years for family members who have been in World War II and Vietnam to want to talk about it.
Anyway, take care and be safe.
Thank you for your discussion.
General overview -- as that conflict is slow paced (from 2014 when open war started), people became much more patient about it. Tolerant even.
As for information... I can compare ukrainian and foreign sources (like CNN) and I see em as doing a good job (well, apart from transparent political agenda showing its colours, from time to time -- like "let's make that war stop by not providing weapon to Ukraine, so we could continue rise good money on business with Russia") providing info about it.
About me... well, I am not on front line. And cannot provide any bloody meat details. But well, in our day and age, there is lots of it available elsewhere.
Sorry for disappointing report, if something. :-)
Thanks for the perspective. And I'm not looking for gory details. We have enough of that in our school shootings and the other 20,000 killings per year.
The US has "Orcs" too. Republicans, militias, Proud Boys, Oath Keepers, the NRA, and assorted sociopaths and gun nuts.
\\The US has "Orcs" too.
That is not name-calling from our ukrainian side. They call it themself that way...
as there is a story of a twisting of the message of that book about "rings of power".
Same as with "Mordor"... educated russians took it for themself.
They found pride in calling themself "ork"-ish, in contrary to westerners being "elf"-ish.
To the level that being called "elf" in common discourse became mild swearing.
The same with being "liberal" or "democrat".
I thought Ukrainians had the perfect word for the evil invaders. Thanks for clearing the "orc" thing up.
How odd it is that they want to identify with fictional hideous and cruel creatures in service of an evil lord of darkness.
In the book, elves are wise, cultured and peaceful, the opposite or orcs.
"Twisted" is indeed a defining characteristic of thugs and brutes all over the world.
Moscow has become the new Mordor, and that is not a good thing.
I have much to learn from you, my Ukrainian friend.
I found this article has a good explanation:
https://www.spectator.co.uk/article/why-are-ukrainians-calling-russian-invaders-orcs-
Why are Ukrainians calling Russian invaders ‘orcs’?
In Russia, Kirill Eskov published a retelling of Tolkien's work in 1999 under the title 'The Last Ringbearer'. Eskov's novel is a mirror-image of Tolkien's. It follows a group of elves, led by Gandalf, who wage unremitting war on the peaceful realm of Sauron; eventually Sauron succeeds in defeating them and destroys their treacherous magic, ushering in a new age of progress and prosperity.
Evil will always want to portray itself as good, and will often claim to be the "real victims" of injustice.
In the US, white nationalists and other white racists are claiming to be the "real victims" of racism and "stolen elections".
\\How odd it is that they want to identify with fictional hideous and cruel creatures in service of an evil lord of darkness.
That is only because knowledge of inner working of USSR is still unknown on the West.That creates all kinds of funny and amusing, but also very dangerous propaganda-wise misunderstandings.(like calling Putin "mafia's don", or taking at face value it's superficial inclination to an Orthodox Faith, and etc) For the very least that what I feel, after that I started to come to English-speaking realm of the Internet -- it looks like information about our side of the World here is very partial, and very biased.
This particular "oddity" is not an oddity at all. That is just retranslated in terms of "orks" and "elfs" of the very basic propaganda about "soviet country of peasants and proletariat", that opposes cruel and cunning world of capitalism and imperialism... in a holy crusade to free all peasants and prols of the Whole World...
\\I have much to learn from you, my Ukrainian friend.
You welcome. That's why I'm here.
\\In Russia, Kirill Eskov published a retelling of Tolkien's work in 1999 under the title 'The Last Ringbearer'. Eskov's novel is a mirror-image of Tolkien's.
That story are a little deeper than that.
I myself only somewhat recently learned about it, and was appaled.
Oldest roots of it I know is from end of 80th, beginning of 90th in big cities like Peterburg and Moscow where youth adopted western "tolkienism" -- cosplaying and roleplaing of being elfs and hobits, and orks.
And most prominent fruit of it is funfic-like "Black Book of Arda" -- history of that Tolkien's world retelled from POV of evil (nothing prominent, from standpoint of literature -- but clearly is a root for that Eskov's and others books).
Well,That is habits of more-less educated and well-paid people of big cities.
Most of ruSSians, some of us prefer to call em Moscovites, is far-far less refined than that.That part found pride in being "vatniks", by the name of crude cheap winter clothing, made of cheap fabric and stuffed with cheap cotton -- essential to a living in winter in the most of regions of Wast Syberia, as well as core "russia".
\\Evil will always want to portray itself as good, and will often claim to be the "real victims" of injustice.
Yeah. "tribute that vice paying to a virtue".
"soviet country of peasants and proletariat", that opposes cruel and cunning world of capitalism and imperialism.
This has a similar manifestation in the US. Rural white people are told by their leaders they are the "real Americans", while the mixed race urban people and their ideas of equality and progress are dismissed as "socialism/communism".
Evil "Leaders" really know how to lie to divide people to gain political power, not caring how dangerous and destructive it will become. Their hate-mongering is embraced by the worst racists and ignorant bigots in the country.
And due to our antiquated electoral election of a president and the unequal minority power in the Senate that benefits this group, their votes are far more powerful than the majority of voters.
They have enjoyed minority rule since the 2000 election.
It's no surprise Putin can manipulate our politics and undermine the country and our elections. He mastered social media and "information warfare".
\\This has a similar manifestation in the US. Rural white people are told by their leaders they are the "real Americans", while the mixed race urban people and their ideas of equality and progress are dismissed as "socialism/communism".
Yeah. That is why nazism it's really is national-socialism. Idea of unity under pretence of some over-emphatised and/or enforced social seemlessness: ethnic, racial, national, economical, religious, etc.
And well, there is no and never was "communism", that is misnomered wildcard. Proof is apparent -- never, no, nada -- there was country who proclaimed being communistic, that was ready and happy to unite with other loudly proclaimed communistic country -- into prophesied Communistic Paradise. :)))
Well, the same as with religious factions. They always only split, and never unite. And etc.
Idea of forcefull unity -- that is utter lie. That can be realised only with military force -- means imperialistic conquier.
\\It's no surprise Putin can manipulate our politics and undermine the country and our elections. He mastered social media and "information warfare".
Mastered, eh?
From my place here, I can see now (after communication with american through internet for some time), that all that "mastery" in propaganda -- they learned from USA.
Really.
What is the most effective tools of ruSSian propaganda today. That is talk-shows, where they pack flashy studios with dirty dozen of "experts" which talk like each for himself, with even some "liberals", even some "pro-ukrainian", but, all show is directed to channel people's attention and choice of whom to believe into pre-defined narrative.
The same is with pundit programs.
The same with "independent bloggers".
The same with "personal channels in Telegram".
And etc.
There was nothing like that in USSR. Where propaganda was gloomy and boring, through some officials monotonicly mumbling same and same riffs on TV, where channels was few.
And there was no time for RFia to reinvent it themself. So. They incorporated it into their media in 90th. When lots of then young journalists was going to USA to learn new ways of doing things in media.
Then, that who was true and centered on journalism... was killed.
And other, atracted by promice of bigger salaries and fame, and even some trikling drops of power... grown into monsters of nowaday Hoebbels-like propaganda.
Here is blog I check frequently, because of good set of information about our part of the world. Good combination of news + West POV perspective on it -- https://windowoneurasia2.blogspot.com
I read somewhere that Hitler was envious of American propaganda because Americans never understood they were getting propaganda from their media.
Thank you for the link to Paul Goble's blog. He is someone who has been around and knows what he is talking about.
I beg myself a pardon in advance, if something. Because, and I know it from bitter experience(s), cultural differences can make most innocent of my words a sure blunder without my expectations of it.
I have certain observations regarding recent events and I'd like to hear your thought on this. I found that inner politics can have similar pattern to a foreign one.
On the example of USA and recent grave case in Uvalde -- group of fully equiped protectors standing outside stalling in preparations, while it all was resolved by some lone semi-vigilante.
And here, what happens in Ukraine -- group of overly prepared for a battle countries staying in their barracks, as if nothing happening, while brave but certainly under-powered ukrainian troops do the job.
Is it similar, or that's just for my eyes? It's interesting, if true.
Because you know. Inner state and policies of any country is very big and hairy thing. And foreign relations is very complex too. But if we can suggest that both are of somewhat similar, something like character of a country in general. As we can say it about individuals. That would help with understanding of it all, isn't it?
I think that is very interesting and important observation. Well, I can say it about my Ukraine too, so it would not look like I trying to say something bad about USA while covering it with such lame "theoretising". For example, I see that our internal politics today -- based to a great extent on our higher-ups trying to give lectures to us people about "how it should be". But really, the same they trying to do in their diplomatic relations with outer public too.
PS One more thing. Funny one, IMHO. Seen on a CNN today.
There is a town in Ukraine. With historical name -- ta-dah, New York.
'Cause in late 19th, early 20th century there was immigrants from Europe, who came to our Easter Ukraine territories to industrialise it there.
So they was giving names to a new places here as they liked.
In soviet times that names was changed, obviously.
But recently, under wave of de-comunisation, was restored.
Oh, wordy explanation, but it was important for understanding.
So... today in CNN they happen to show some flick from that place.
And called it... >Niu York< :-)))
Well, I understand their problem. As it is known from previous times.
For example in time of 2008 year war of RFia against Georgia Republic on a Causas.
There was noted commoution in USA, by people who misunderstood it like if Russia attacked Georgia state of USA. :-)))
Yes, I also see a similarity in the case of Ukraine and the school massacre, besides the cold-blooded sociopath natures of the shooter and the invader.
The law enforcement officers, like NATO and the global community of nation, were frightened.
The police were frightened of the heavily armed killer, as most countries are frightened of Putin starting a nuclear war.
Bullies prey upon frightened victims. Fear is the tool of tyrants, Nazis, fascists, dictators, mass murderers, and terrorists.
Geographical names can confuse people. We have cities of the same name across the country.
"Springfield" is the name of 34 towns and cities in the US.
Another case is the state of New Mexico. Many Americans think it is in the country of Mexico.
I think the world would be much better off if we had more geography and history taught in schools. People don't tend to consider foreign peoples and historical events beyond their local part of the country or world.
Too many people, police, and countries are living in fear and ignorance. It's a bully's world.
\\Another case is the state of New Mexico. Many Americans think it is in the country of Mexico.
Something, something gazpacho, yeah. :-)
Well, I was more bewildered to know that there is towns like St.Petersberg (as in RFia) and Odessa (big city in Ukraine too) in USA.
\\I think the world would be much better off if we had more geography and history taught in schools.
I, with my experience of studing in soviet school, with regrets, but would disagree.
1. They was giving education based on lots of facts memorising. But anyway, those who was not interested in studing hardly recieved much good of it.
2. Education based on memorisation is prone to ideological bending, through control of what facts would be provided, and what ommited. As well as produce people who lacks agency to think for themself. And even zealots, throught indoctrinating em into believing that they "know ALL true facts", means that anything they do not know still is automatically not true.(for example, do you know how they teach Koran? That is pecular -- young children need to memorise ALL of it flawlessly, in Arabic, which they do not know yet... and only after examination that they remember it to the letter, they start to teach them what it all means... easy to see how it turns into calls for Jihad, isn't it?)
Well, that is natural, for a country as USSR was. And explains current behavior of RFia and RFians.
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